Is D and D a real community or a trade fair?

Convener: Phelim McDermott

Summary of discussion, conclusions and/or recommendations:

Report Context: So first off my notes got thrown away in the clear up. I have decided to not interpret that as any kind of indication regarding the session question! What this means is it would be great if people contributed to the report by adding comments of what they said and also say who else was there!   

So this report is a very incomplete, subjective recalling of a few of the areas the conversation went and covered and a few of my own conclusions and thoughts as someone whose been running DandD with Improbable over the years.   

I called the session for a number of reasons the first was some pub feedback. This was a few people telling me that compared to previous years the event had seemed to them a little frustrating. This was because it was being treated by some as a more superficial networking event and the conversations were not getting the opportunity to go deeper or as deep as they would have liked.  

Another reason was that despite “Whoever comes are the right people” I felt the room to not have as much age diversity as previously and missed the people who had both the wisdom of "eldership" and also the grit and forthrightness of experience. Those people who were not afraid to say the unsayable and stir things up a bit. I'd spoken with Alan Cox and he'd communicated that he almost didn't come and it was only when he was nudged by me tweeting something personal to him did it tip it into him deciding to come. Because of the potential feeling of "I've had those conversations' means that one wonders whats the reason for coming might still be.  We recognised that if you keep coming back to DandD that this changed your role from someone who comes “to get stuff” or even “to give stuff” but into an elder whose presence does change the atmosphere of the space and can teach people how to use OS to create a real community. The presence of these people was something we missed but we also recognised that we are also becoming those people ourselves a movement away from coming to the event to get something but into an Eldership role. Which looks after all the voices. This role is also less of an "active" presence and more of a "being" role. A role whose presence makes certain things possible.  That's how I kicked the session off. We then covered  a number of areas. People reported that one good thing was that they had enjoyed communicating with people not with their labels and designated badges. There had been a lack of people “shoulder surfing” compared to SOTA and other events. However some were well pissed off about how they hadn't managed to get to speak and that the facilitation of groups had been “poor” or selfish by some. That the groups hadn't worked on what they wanted to and they felt they couldn't control that. This was particularly difficult for those who weren't confident about speaking in large groups. There was a request for guidance and a different facilitation methodology to support those who can't speak up or who can't be heard.  Couldn't that be provided at the start?   

I said that OS wasn't a methodology itself but that any methodology could be used within it and all could be called as a session.  I thought that the group should be allowed to evolve that in an emergent way. I Feel strongly that adding stuff from the top down was not the way and that the great thing about OS was it was a process that teaches itself. If it was needed you could call a session for it. So "a group where those who don't get to speak get to speak" and are supported. We then attempted to do it in the moment and used a talking stick and pen. Different people in the group took responsibility to make sure people who wanted to speak got heard. We were sometimes not so good at it (ESpecially me) but we enjoyed working on it in the moment and it was relieving. We enjoyed learning from each other and I enjoyed the shared leadership of the session. Whilst noticing my own tendency to hog the talking pen.   

One thing mentioned was that some people just asking forthrightly for their needs was important and that clarity of intention in calling sessions was good then if you knew it WAS a session about networking then you didn't have to go if you didn't want to. There is nothing wrong with the trade fair aspect if clarity of intention and session means you don't have to go there if you don't want to.  

I also mentioned being awake about when a group has separated it's intention and knowing those who want to talk about one thing can break off and do that whilst others can go a divergent way. All these are possible but it takes people being courageous about stepping up for that and making it happen.   

I talked about one of the aspects of community is the balancing of the impulse to look after one's own needs and individual growth and journey whilst also looking after the whole group. A concentration on too much of either one of these aspects feels like it can dissipate the group. Or the possibilty to be either too selfish or subsumed. This spectrum is important for the group to be aware of.     

We talked about calling sessions where people were silent. Movement sessions and the possibility of using different methodologies which could help this community to learn from each other.  It was noted that in the "women on top" session a small number of women were able to dominate the conversation in a large group.    

We talked about different methodologies that can help useful communication like Marshall Rosenberg's non violent communication. Nancy Kline's great book “time to think” and her work of the creation intelligent thinking.   

There was a desire and a call to have conversations that really matter that aren't just information exchange but we're real connection.   

I made a decision to make one of the d and d satellites about real community and learning and sharing effective communication skills. This was an agreed action.   

I also talked about what brought the valuable community people that we had missed might be not trying to push them to come back, but telling them why they were valued because often they didn't even know. I told Jenn in the moment why I enjoyed her continued presence at d and d and we agreed telling people why we valued them there was a good thing. We fantasised about telling people why we missed them to bring them back now soon after the event rather than trying to persuade them before the next d and d. We talked about small actions that we could do to let people know why they were missed at DandD7 not to guilt trip them but to let them know of their value in the community.  

 

What is community?  In the closing circle  lot of the people talked of having had their Loneliness and isolation taken care of by this weekend. This was definitely an aspect of DandD which is important and part of it's community value and responsibility to artists.   Other's of course could disagree and I find myself returning to Peter Block's work on community and his definition of it. This is that an authentic community can hold the space for dissent. IE the measure of whether DandD can be considered if it is an authentic community is whether it can still look after the people who don't consider it to be one!   Inauthentic communities expel people who disagree with them.   

Cults don't let people leave.    

The law of two feet means we constantly have the possibility to be awake to the groups needs and our own. We can leave or make the active choice to step up or back into the conversation. whilst looking after both our own needs for safety and attending to an awareness of the needs of others. Open space is an art of invitation..  which means its OK not to come and not to turn up. That means ever, or come, and then don't come  for a few years and then come back and be still be valued as an important part of the DandD community. For me community isn't a frozen entity it's an ongoing process of mindfulness around where I sit with my own authentic needs and the groups needs. We cant sit back and just ask is it a community or not?  Then answer the question and relax. It is a conversation. We have to keep asking that question as a practice because it might be one moment and the next moment not.  Then we consider "Having said all that what do we do now?"  A lot of the people at our session seemed to be deeply interested in the community aspect of DandD and there was an agreed commitment to work on that and our literacy and effectiveness around that. We were very pleased to be having this conversation.   

Keep the space open and keep the invitation alive! 

On the value of doubt, reflection, uncertainty and not knowing (quiet people especially welcome)

Convener: Rajni Shah

Participants: Joanne Hartley, John Pinder, Emily Hodgson, Kitty Martin, Daniel Bye, Mhairi Grealis, Sarah Pinshon, Chris Goode, David Catling, Paul Whitlock, Mark Maughan, Sophie Grodin, Lucy Avery, Steve Ryan, Kath Burlinson, Chris Grady, Simon Bowes, Tassos Stevens, Paschale Straiton, Theron Schmidt, Matt Trueman, and others.

Summary of discussion

I place a lot of value on spaces for reflection and doubt - and listening. And by Sunday morning, I hadn't really found a way for those spaces to be present at D&D, so I called this session.

What I didn't do was think much about how I might actually create the kind of space I was craving within a very loud room where lots of other conversations were happening simultaneously. I'm really grateful that so many people showed up and stayed present with the discussion - and can only apologise that the idea didn't occur to me earlier, when I might have come up with some brilliant way to create a more conducive space where we didn't have to shout. Nevertheless, we talked of...

Not knowing as a process in life

"There is so much we're supposed to know"

Engage with 'not knowing' as a process of moving forward - our constant movement between spaces of knowing and not knowing and how we might allow the value of each affect the other - the value in consciously putting oneself in a space of not knowing - but also needing a clear sense of self when valuing the space of not knowing. Which can feel tricky!

Relationship to Failure

Someone pointed out that uncertainty and doubt are always present in a rehearsal or making process - so what's the big deal?

Perhaps those spaces are always present, but at some level we are hardwired to think of spaces of uncertainty as spaces of failure. What transformations occur when we continue to inhabit these spaces instead of moving through them as quickly as possible towards a resolution?

What is the relationship between placing oneself in the unknown, and listening or empathy? What if leaving my own certainties allows me to be more in the world?

Thinking about timescales (and referring back to Simon Bowes' session on "It's going to take years") - what if something that appears to fail in the short-term eventually represents a really important shift in thinking?

Long timeframes towards change.

Again, how do we allow this kind of thinking to be something a wider audience can relish?

Audiences

There's no lack of makers interested in addressing these questions - but how do we respond to these spaces as audience members?

What does it mean to create a piece of work where the audience is free to be reflective and journey into a space of not knowing? How can we avoid slow, reflective spaces being antagonising or boring to audiences? Especially within a theatre context (as opposed to live art, for example, where this is more common)

Maybe we need to think more about how a piece of work is framed/introduced, how an audience is prepared for a piece of work. Thinking through audience expectations that are set up through the medium and its traditions (different in visual arts / live art / theatre), through the space (theatre, gallery, page, browser) and how the audience move through it, and therefore also the way that time operates within that space.

It is as if we have all been lowered into an atmosphere of glass - Anne Carson

Re-educate

Someone spoke of the importance of re-educating. My notes aren't great on this bit - but I think this relates back to the idea of frames, of thinking about the wider frame of presenting a piece of work, and acknowledging the notion of re-educating within a creative thinking process. If I want to really change the way audiences watch this work, what can I do to let them know?

Slowness as Resistance

Slowness is a resistance of narrative / expectation / speed / knowledge.

Sometimes that resistance hits the wall of a fast world. Matt spoke of not being able to engage with my show, Glorious, not because of an unwillingness, but rather an inability.

Transparency and withholding

Theron noted the difference between work where artists and audiences are entering a space of not knowing, and work where the artist is in a place of knowing and the audience is entering a space of not knowing.

We talked about transparency, and the extent to which knowledge is withheld from an audience - and how this is handled.

We didn't (but I wish we had) talk about manipulation of audiences, and whether this is desirable or unattractive or inevitable.

Gentleness can be counterproductive

Simon proposed the idea that maybe we're too gentle and worried around creating these alternative spaces. Maybe as audience members we sometimes want to be faced with an obstacle we can't get around. How do we create a culture that acknowledges that audiences can feel grateful for challenge and having been pushed?

We talked again about spaces before or after a difficult performance - the space for audiences after Internal by Belgian theatre company Ontroerend Geod, for example, or the lead-in to Coney's works.

Walking

We went for a walk at dusk.

It’s gonna take years: On the virtue(s) of taking your time

Convener: Simon Bowes

Participants: Joanne Hartley; Steve Ryan; Bethany Pitts; Alex Lehman; Matt Ball; Daniel Pitt; Ros Williams; Maddy Costa: Dachel Davies; Steve Pitman (and others); Greg McLaren

Summary of discussion, conclusions and/or recommendations:

Note that the session was called to try and identify a dissatisfaction with two (seemingly pervasive) orthodoxies, the FIRST: Edinburgh-once-a-year-or-you’re-invisible; the SECOND: Scratching-it-will-make-it-better: This is what we come up with: Maybe we NEED urgency – bound up with who you have to ask for the money – gestation periods can be too long (lost-in-gestation!) – “...being okay with your shit ideas” – “we should be practicing all the time” (perhaps a painter who produces one painting a year is automatically going to be a shittier painter than one who produces ten a year) – Scratch culture often ensures that by the time an artist “…considers the work finished, everybody’s seen it…” – Can early-career / emergent artists afford to work privacy? Is there an alternative to scratch that is artist-led, rather than venue-led, fairly enclosed, invitation-only, free, not pay-what-you-can? EXAMPLE Uninvited Guests just can’t do anything quickly (Mr. Dufty and Mr. Clarke have FULL TIME JOBS) – necessitates short, infrequent working patters (presumably with plenty of time for reflection) – they might not be prolific but they maintain their profile and never look seem to look hungry – how do we find dedicated time? – TIME IS ECONOMIC – Who says audiences knows better than artists what the work should be? – Audiences notice things the artist may have overlooked, but often give artists BAD ADVICE about how to develop their work – contrast all this with EXAMPLE Song of the Goat (Poland), or other comparable European companies: length of time spent developing the work permits depth and intricacy – “What’s the life of a show?” / “2 years to make, 2 years to show” / crossing over – “‘time’ is a question of efficiency…” – “wider than one individual process” – “there is no ladder to climb” – “…we’re not footballers (only as good as our last game)|” – No! – “…We’re as interesting as our entire body of work…” – but if let’s say, the reviewer / writer sees a bad one, they might miss a show or two before they go back – WRITING ABOUT THEATRE – “…you’re as good as the last thing you did and the thing you’re going to do next…” – is it possible to write to support a work / artist in another way? – getting a little review (well-starred or not) isn’t always that helpful – “…I’m discovering that I’m a slow thinker and a slow writer…” (becoming Okay with that) – SPILL Festival salons/ dialogues / ‘stings’: commissioned writing – all pretty encouraging – cut – EXAMPLE: “…Frayn had a five year hiatus before ‘Copenhagen’…” – MONEY BUYS TIME – but fuck the money – “…you have a duty of care to the work…” (you have a duty of care to the audience) – long timeframes permit continuities, sustaining the discourse around the work (documentation, critical thinking) – “…the little commitments make up The Big One…” – if we want to slow things down, there’s a value in that…if we make the process part of the show…a long process doesn’t necessarily mean a slow process – “the luxury of time” – “…we’re working in an industry where everyone wants to be working in that industry…” – “if you’re going to do something, really fucking do it” – “…if you can do it for £300, try getting 6…” – talking about getting Lyn to see your stuff: “…be sure that you’re ready to invite me along…” – A CULTURE SHIFT of TAKING YOUR TIME – generosity towards emerging artists (or: to an emerging / developing work, even if it’s made by an old artist) – giving time to something can buy you out of that economy EXAMPLE: Simon from Rough Fiction – a permanent ensemble, by consensual agreement – free space donated by the Actor’s Centre, for six hours every Saturday – core artists working on skills, founded in an open space, leading to a deep sense of collectivity – nobody got paid – has resulted in a finished show developed over eighteen months, equivalent of nine weeks of rehearsal spread out – in some circumstances the work itself is its own reward – what else are you spending / investing in, if not time – some kind of TRIANGLE DIAGRAM, like an equation Quick = Money, Good = Time – yeah: it can’t be cheap AND good AND quick! –  you’ve got to GIVE THE PROJECT WHAT THE PROJECT ASKS OF YOU – “…long time-frames are all well and good, but you’ve got to have outcomes, and you’ve got to stand by them…” – the work asks you: what kind of artist do you want to be –

Why do more people* not do Ta-Ke-Ti-Na? (* particularly/including actors and performers)

Convener(s): Gerard Bell

Participants: Theron Schmidt, Morven, Rosemary Lee, Danny Scheinmann, Alex and others.

 

Summary of discussion, conclusions and/or recommendations:

The obvious answer is because not many people know about it?

This introduced it further.

We talked about it, we did some exercises, played some games and talked some more.

Simply (hopefully) Ta Ke Ti Na is a practice of polyrhythm, where you are encouraged to vocalize one rhythmic pattern (syllabically), while you feet move to another and your hands to another all at the same time. The leader (a great and modest expert) leads the circle and with a chant to be imitated helps the circle in the rhythm and throws them off it.

If this sounds bizarre it is impossible to do, it is the greatest fun, and reassembles the mind. It is like meditation while being active.

Part of the purpose is that you can’t do it but sometimes you can.

I recommend as an activity to anyone, Simon McBurney recommends it to performs as essential to the act of being onstage, so it is interesting, maybe, that it is hard to persuade actors to do it.

Look on the website www.gotingo.co.uk for more blurb, and for contacts, or to add your name to the mailing list.

Or ask me.

Cheers and ta!

Please Share Your Best Procrastination/ Anti-Procrastination Techniques

Convener: Imogen Butler-Cole

Participants: Tamsin Clarke, Matthew Smallwood, Leyla Asadi, Jannifer Tan, Kelli, Verity Standen, Rose Biggin, Mhairi Grealis, Mary O’Connor, Jamie Jubairi

Cross-RefSession 85, why do I take so long to do something?

The Procrastinator’s Support Group will be convening at the Jungle on the Barbican roof on Saturday 3^rd March at 4pm. Please try some of the techniques below in the meantime, see how they work for you, report back! If you can’t be there in person we can skype you if you provide me with your email id/ skype id.

 Summary of discussion, conclusions and/or recommendations:

Lists:

Transfer a to-do list onto lots of different coloured post-its, written in differently coloured pens. Put them all up on a board (perhaps in a particular configuration depending on importance/ effect on consuquent topics). Then you’ll pick them according to different (aesthetic) priorities. When actioned move onto a separate board to the “done” list is as concrete as the “to do”, not just crossed out words on a list

Similar arrangements on desk-top with folders – one side is to do, the other side is done.

Self-Management:

Give yourself a line manager – can be yourself or someone else. Fix dates by which you need to report back to them about particular tasks.

Or a co-worker/ buddy that you check in with weekly/ daily to see how you’ve been doing.

Ask yourself what advice you’d give somebody else

Deliniate a space for work – avoid the bedroom if possible or if in the bedroom can you somehow define that space?

Make sure you shower/ get dressed/ wear shoes (particular shoes?)/ go for a run/ walk/ stretch before you start work. And NEVER open the computer/ work book until you have done these things

Or if not first thing schedule a time for exercise at some point in the day – this can also be used as a reward/ incentive

Even just take the stretch you do in bed in the morning a little bit further – do it for just 5 minutes to get your body (and therefore your mind) working

Know when your productivity is best and schedule yourself to work within these times/ work to your own rhythm

Open Space yourself: ring the bell, check in (how am I feeling, what would I like to achieve) call sessions for yourself, write them up on a schedule board, decide when to attend each

“Become masculine” – don’t multi-task, concentrate on one thing only until it’s completely finished

Scheduling:

5-10-15 minutes (works best on admin-type tasks): if you have five tasks allot each of them 5 minutes. Set an alarm. After 5 minutes move on to the next task. Do this with all tasks, then go back and spend 10 minutes on each, then 15. You’ll be amazed at how quickly things get done.

Or allot half an hour per task. Spread sheet schedule with coloured sections for different tasks?

Have allotted “working hats” for each project – the kids show has a kids hat that you wear when you’re working on that project. When you’re going to work on the history play you change to the history hat. Or other appropriate items of clothing.

On a mac you can set up different accounts, some without internet access. Create accounts for different projects so you have to log off and go into the other specific work account if you want to work on something else – hence avoiding blurry lines between projects

Limit the time you spend online – give yourself allotted hours when you will be online/ will not be online. And let other people that you are responsible to know when these will be.

Self-Care:

Stop feeling you have made no progress. What is progress? Give yourself small achievable goals and acknowledge when you’ve achieved them.

Make a list of small achievements over the day/ week/ year

When it all feels overwhelming: Make a list of things you’re grateful for

Change the way you speak to yourself, treat yourself with the care you’d treat a child: “this is what I’ve achieved” not “I’m a bit crap, I achieve nothing”

If you get overwhelmed take off a day or two – however much time you can possibly allow yourself – and ban yourself from doing anything that begins with the words “I must”. Take play dates. Treat yourself. Walk, swim, bake, buy a hat, do whatever stimulates your idea brain

Make a pi-chart of yourself in 7 sections, name each section according to what you are made up of. Balance it

Spider-graph: health, money, friends, relationships, work, spirituality as points around the edge. Centre is zero, outside edge is 10, put a dot along the line to show where you are now. Try to balance the spider into a nice circle…

Goals:

Set achievable goals – write 500 words/ day – or whatever works for you – and when you have achieved them allow yourself to recognize this fact. Reward yourself! Take time off before you move on to some other task

Rewards

Biscuit breaks – don’t have any until you’ve done a specified task

Schedule after-work drinks with other freelancers cause you don’t get to go to the pub after work with your colleagues

Create any reward system for yourself that works for you!

Texts/ techniques/ writing/ videos on the topic:

The Artist’s Way (good self care/ routines/ creativity in everyday life in turn helps stimulate creativity in working practice…etc)

TED talks: Happiness in Business (give goals, don’t push them, allow yourself to realize you’ve achieved them); Creativity and the Self) Amy Tan?)

Blog called “the fluent self” you meet yourself where you are

Brian Eno’s Oblique Strategy Cards, available online for £30 ;)

I want (to make?) a project which pays people to make connections and come up with ideas

Convener: Bridget Floyer

Participants: Dan Baker, Zoe Cobb, Aliki ?

Summary of discussion, conclusions and/or recommendations:

Not many people came to my session and I still can’t decide whether that means it’s a bad idea, not needed, too good to be true (I did choose Utopia as my location) or whether I just worded it badly. Certainly there feels like there is a lot of context I struggled to get into my punchy title. I probably could have (there have been other conversations about what we can and can’t do this weekend) but didn’t manage to.

My idea came from several observations verging together about which I also still haven’t quite decided whether they come together meaningfully or not.

• Trying to make work independently for the first time aged 32 feels difficult. Lots of schemes which help people are for those under 25 or under 30.  I think my experience of working for organizations for the last 10 years is helpful but I don’t think it makes it SO much easier that I don’t still need (want?) help! And there are others for whom this will be so much more true
• Even development funding needs a strong idea – a  creative idea and an idea of key people you want to work with. This takes time, energy and often money, and until you have an established organization this usually means doing this unpaid
• An article in the Guardian about how many old Etonian actors there are
• Feels to me like there is a gap between being encouraged to get involved in the arts as a young person and being able to move into employment. Audiences and workforces in mainstream theatre are not getting bigger or more diverse. I don’t think anything will change until we genuinely empower people from more diverse (culturally/socio-economically and otherwise?) backgrounds and that means giving equal employment opportunities. If people can’t afford to do the frequently unpaid schemes which are on offer and they need to get experience to get paid jobs then that is very exclusionary – equally if they can’t afford to give the time energy and money to coming up with ideas they’ll struggle to get started independently

My idea is to have an intensive scheme that brings people together maybe for just a week to have time to work on ideas and have time to work practically with other people, and help them get to a place where they have experience and maybe ideas to move forward on. Mentoring could also be involved.

This would have an emphasis on process over product though I was imagining some form of sharing.

There doesn’t seem to be such a scheme (though China Plate? does seem to operate a scheme slightly similar for devising companies to have paid time with new writers) so I want to try and make one.

Ideally I’d like this to help people from a variety of disciplines – producers, actors, directors, designers, writers, other artists. Everyone should be paid but as equally as possible.

My questions

• Who owns the idea afterwards if you bring different people together
• What’s the role of the producers in that space?
• Who gets involved / who really needs it / how do you make sure those people are the ones who get involved
• Will anyone fund it? (I reckon it could be done for £25k (or smaller and cheaper) if space and some other venue-type support was in-kind)
• Who decides who takes part – do I have the expertise/experience to choose?

PREAMBLE OVER: BELOW ARE THE RESULTS OF THE SESSION

As already mentioned, one piece of feedback was the lack of people at my session.

I spoke to three people, one other producer and two artists. Both artists agreed this would be useful and that they have ideas which they need help to get off the ground. This seemed to be partly about them needing a producer (and a producer that doesn’t need to be paid until the idea has mileage) and partly about a desire to collaborate and work ideas through.

Won’t be able to note whole conversations but these were key things for me:

Dan and I talked about how it would be important for it not to be too restrictive with too many conditions or caveats. We said both that there must be loads of empty spaces around but also that space really seems to be at a premium (I have seen various possibilities for space during DandD so that’s been interesting)

Zoe mentioned lots of things that would be helpful that I hadn’t even thought of (as I had a practical workshop style thing in mind) eg phone, computer, wifi, conversations, planning and strategy sessions, advice on what makes a show workable etc as well as practically trying out ideas.

This was good because it slightly answered my question as to what the producers might do in that space without becoming glorified stage managers. I felt strongly they should be involved (ha, of course, as I'm a producer!) as that feels like an important relationship to allow people to create as well as artist to artist relationships.

I also realised during discussions that ideas can take a long time to develop and maybe my thought that ideas could be come up with during the session is overambitious. Aliki and I talked about how lots of artists will have an idea but they may be unformed and not in a state that’s fundable. Maybe I should be looking for artists who have ideas they want to bring in to explore.

Another thought that came out was not to have to know answers was positive – to have a space for trials, where a sharing was the ideal end result but not necessarily performance, not audience focused and that the possibility of no sharing at all was an option

I was also assuming a theatre venue was the space I was looking for but other spaces could be a possibility especially if a performance (even a scratch one) is not going to be a necessary end result of the project. Even scratch performances are quite formal in a sense if they’re in a theatre space so maybe more beneficial not to be.

OTHER THOUGHTS WHICH DIDN’T COME OUT OF THIS SESSION BUT OUT OF OTHERS

I’ve been interested in who leads with an idea and I went to some sessions about post-dramatic drama and design-led theatre which all questioned who can lead a process. I’d be interested in having people come in with ideas who are not directors.

Piloting would be a good idea and this could be possible in a much smaller way than I was originally thinking I’d want to pilot. Maybe one group made up of one artist with an idea and others in a venue which has very close links to a diverse community and could bring in emerging artists (of any age) to see how the week itself works and what’s useful before looking at the wider format of applications etc

In fact not having applications per se in an open way but referrals might get the “right people” – or even better a mix, not to ghettoise?

Might be useful to bring in some established artists who might not need the project so much but benefit from reinvigoration of practice from working with new people or having a test space for an idea (or working on someone else’s idea) and again meet less ghettoisation, more useful for emerging artists to meet a mix of people.

Would it then be even more important that everyone gets paid and everyone gets paid the same?

Seth Honnor (hope he doesn’t mind me quoting) said creative practice is a constant tension between openness and quality and though I need to think about that a bit more, I think that’s a good context in which to set the above – have some known quality and some unknown openness (which doesn’t mean either isn’t risky but to different degrees?)

Again possibilities for space came from other sessions eg the Theatre Lab session about people in Streatham Hill (music project, aaaaagh have temporarily lost email address sorry) who have space and want to encourage use of it for artistic collaboration and no-one came to that session either – interesting!

If anyone is post-DandD interested in this or can offer help for me to do it (I’m determined to try) I can be found on Twitter @bridget_flo or at http://anoccasionalwildgoose.blogspot.com which is a slightly rambling blog about theatre and finding 100 things to love about London but you can contact me through it.

What does ‘Post-Internet’ theatre look like?

Convener: Susanna Davies-Crook

Participants: Anon. – at various stages included Tom Ross Williams, Tassos Stevens, Matt Trueman, Amy Letman, Hannah Nicklin and more

Summary of discussion, conclusions and/or recommendations:

How theatre and performance practices are changing in an emergent age of digital nativity.

How technology is used in theatre

What a ‘post-medium’ condition could equate to in theatre

How character is used

How narrative changes across networked experience

The fear of losing the site of the theatre or the durational performative experience

Changing forms

The importance of live experience

Can you have theatre if it is just one participant experiencing something through the screen

Short sharp bursts of theatre or experience as equivalent to short sharp bursts of information on the Internet

Questions of access to the net

Timelines

Bombardment of narratives and information that the internet allows and how this changes artistic and writing practices

The difference in experience and intention of maker and audience

Dries Verhoeven (sp?)

Tim Etchells

SMS spectacular

Blast Theory

Rythmss

Coney

“Rules of Play” – book

gaming as a way of accessing fragmented narrative devices and self-emergent or self-organising narratives

How can theatre expose the characteristics of the network or machine – ghost in the machine

Rosa Menkman – glitch

Psycho-digital

Real / not real

Matt Locke

Character vs Roleplay

User-journey access

Deborah Pearson  - narrative in the internet age

Not using tech as a bolt on but it being irrevocably intrinsic to the creation and presentation of the work

Orange Tree performance

Grabbing attention, shifting audience attentions, overwhelming them

What do you do when you find an “idea” you’ve been working on is already out there? …OR…Why do I take so long to do something?

Convener: Gerard Bell

Participants: Chris Hallam, Cindy Oswin, Dan Copeland, Nicholas McInerny and others

Summary of discussion, conclusions and/or recommendations:

This came out of the experience of having two things that I have been thinking of, or done but left for a long while, seemingly being done by someone else. This within the last two weeks. One today was Li”s announcement that she was producing a book on …”nothing” ( I had made a piece in 2007 : “….nothing now…”.

So I refer you to Li’s session and also to session 94, on procrastination.

Below are some of the questions that came up in the manner they came up. No answer really, but some suggestions and many questions.

(This will be a scattered summary)

(Think that ) the first question is an “unlucky coincidence”.

The thought process – “I will do that some day…”

We kept coming back to the word “structure”. How a structure around it helps or is necessary. Cf all the distractions of home (up to time with partner and feeding the cat)

My inertia? Where does it come from?

What motivates you to get started? What is it that stops or postpones?

Frequently a absence of, or need for, support: practical emotional.

Is this from ourselves or outside?

We have an idea, we go home do some stuff, have a rest, watch too much crap tv ( and look back on the time mis-spent.)

Once embarked the deadline  is helpful.

Most of the work is finished in the run up to the deadline.

“I can’t write. I can’t write.”

Procrastination was mentioned. “I have it to a fine art”

I was asked do I question what to do; think it through to  the point where it fails. I said, interestingly, that I do it in life quite a bit; but not in work.

There is all the other  work you have to do as a solo artist ( if you are doing youir own work). Feel you need support for that. And what about the emotional support; the endorsement.

There is (as an actor) the waiting to be engaged. That is an endorsement. Otherwise you have to give it to yourself.

Is the hesitation from….”putting yourself on the line”.

Some people have enormous chutzpah and ride through this.

Another question can up. How does Ann Widdecombe (curiously) do it? Work as an MP + all the other stuff including writing?

Artists like Matisse, Picasso (Ann will be pleased) were mentioned – the enormous amount of work they produce.

Is it sheer psychic energy? Do these makers have un unstoppable energy, like a fountain? Do I bubble occasionally, and that is okay, or am I in some way blocked? Blocking a flow?

It was asked what are the ersonal traits that get in the way of what you want to do?

Or is the taking of time  a hindrance or advantageous.

One of us felt he had a past littered with good ideas. Having one in 3 or 4 days someone else would have started, done. Time passes; it is not done; it is not worth doing.

We talked of the differences between age and youth, of energy, confidence, awareness.

We came back to the synchronicity or pre-empting. Can you have two shows about the Voyager Spacecraft?

It is in the “zeitgeist” . It is  “timely”.

ASnd “isn’t it great?”

The difference in the world of science where patents are chased to preserve property is “commerce” not creativity.

The interest and virtue of seeing presenting different takes on the same (ostensible) subject. Wuthering Heights, Don Q, nothing.

All humans procrastinate: we just don’t talk about it.

But what do you do if you don’t have a deadline?

Advice: Tell someone you are doing it – official or friend – then next time you see them you will feel you should have done something)

              Put ideas on a postcard,. Send it to someone. They call you back to ask.

What holds us back …is it the fear of death? Once you come to a conclusion you are a step nearer.

There is a value too things taking a long time. ( Though not if the idea drops away). And leaving things forr a long time can’t be applied to hovering. Or…can it?

Does everything have to be tidy before you can start? (Is this prevarication?)

The time  taken can be valuable. Stuff feeds in.

“When I have a really cracking idea, the thing I do is “nothing”.” If it is still there six months later it might have to be done. You have to be obsessed, or stuck with it. It takes a long time reducing till you have the juices left: this is the kick start. This is how the time is used. (or is it?)

Also do not be distracted by the thought something has to be difficult.

Are there different creative personalities who simply discipline themselves to work alone? …. Yes, it is a temperamental issue of character.

Putting your self against other people’s process might be useful; give you other routes.

Set yourself rules!! (eg the next scene must have more characters; I mustt do this then; discipline rules). Riules and limitations are realloy important. Then it is noott about you

We discussed the temperament of being an actor, and that something has to shifty from that. As an actor you wait for work, (even to be given permission (to exist; waiting for someone to confer a start.) It is of course a valuable part of the actor’s personality.

But how much do we value our legitimacy as an actor (to make).

It was asked if the speed the industry moves now makes things difficult and was suggested that TV is a monstrous consumer and disposer of ideas.

Cindy, who makes a deal of own work, said at the start she is commissioned.

Gerard spoke of the very important ingrediant of being given studio space – rather than having to buy it. This was a kind of validation that helped him start. Once in the space (structure, time) there was no problem.

If you have a problem with a deadline bring it nearer.

Do not be so hard on yourself; but also try and do something specific by the end of the week.

Don’t fight the problem, but describe it.

Be practical. Phone up and ask for a space. You have started doing something. You might have to use it.

Integrating design in to the devising process. How?

Convener: Alice Hoult

Participants: Sam Smith, Alan Sharpington, Solene Marie, Kelly Golding, Ed Jaspers and various other nice people

Summary of discussion, conclusions and/or recommendations:

My reason for calling the topic was to find out about other people’s experience of designing during the devising process. As its a new process for me, I wanted to talk about my slight fears about what the next stages of the process will be.

I have found the process of devising incredibly invigorating. The concept of designing something without a prescribed space, script, budget was something that was hard for me to get my head around. After a year of intermittent workshops and finally a week long session my ideas are really forming and they feel so exciting and vital to the piece and the story. Now we are at a stage when a script is being written I am wondering what will happen to my design ideas when all those usual structures arrive into the process. Its exciting and scary at this point

Scary = exciting

- We talked about site specific theatre where the site is the design from the beginning where you don’t have the chance to change anything at the last minute as its always integral to the piece.

- adapting a steam-punk picture book for stage, was an example of a project where the initial idea has a strong visual identity so it would be useful for a designer to be present from the outset

- this might not be the case for all productions was one comment that was made, sometimes it is right for the work to have a designer come into the process later.

I disagree with this! – I think that as a designer the earlier you can come into a process the better on every level! It means that the design is a richer, truer piece of storytelling rather than just a backdrop. Of course there are issues of finance here which were also brought up. But as designers usually work for a set fee rather than a weekly rate it might be something that the initiator of the project would discuss with the designer early on to establish what their their level of involvement would be. Ask us! We might just want to be involved earlier even if it means taking a pay cut!

We talked about moments of magic created by design (the image of the virgin mary with a flashing heart) in a production, how are those moments created?

Is the answer – by having a designer involved from the outset ?

A designer’s role in a rehearsal room/devising is simply to be another set of eyes,

An auteur as much as a director/writer/devisor is.

A visual dramaturg.

Its also to make an ambient and fertile space for creating work

Talking to Will Reynolds later on and he said that a designers role is often about being the director’s best friend.

Bringing lighting in allows you to play with atmosphere at an early stage in the work. Can visual moments be a starting point for a piece of theatre? it doesn’t have to be text, and a designer can be an author in this way too

Someone came up with the phrase ‘creative midwifery’ (!!!) facilitating ideas not simply having or executing them.

For a designer to be present in a devising process is not just a visual thing but they are another set of eyes and ears that might just look at something in a different way. Flag up parts of the script that might have problems later on.

For a designer its about having the confidence to create and collaborate no matter what ends up on stage. More collaboration means you might have less control over the end result but you might also have been influential to other areas in the piece

A designer needs to know how to make themselves a valuable part of the process. Also to work out what you know you need to tell the story.

A few people came along who want to work with a designer but don’t know how, or are scared to do so. There is a certain amount of risk involved in collaborating but if you find the right person then magic will happen! You will find them, its just about taking the plunge

I mentioned that we were looking for a space to perform our piece in and Someone pointed me in the direction of Roland who is setting up a pop-up performance space. Thank you, it was great and interesting to meet him and could be a good direction for the project.

Someone talked about directing a piece that has a designer on stage drawing and making adjustments to the surroundings as the performance progresses, it changes every night.  (Can we still call this ‘design’ as by the nature of the word it defines something that is about pre-determined choices)  The designer is then becoming a performer – blurring of roles – enabling creativity!

Since the session I have been thinking about these directors/initiators who want to work with a designer but don’t know how. How can we be more visible? We are all so different, so how do you find someone who suits you? If its all about finding someone who suits your working process then perhaps we should all be more explicit about HOW we like to work on our websites rather then focusing on what the end result looks like.

If anyone has any answers or thoughts on this then please do e-mail me through my site www.alicehoult.net I’m up for similar style collaborations and enjoy throwing around ideas

Also since the session I have doodled some talking beetles with different shaped heads.

Feel free to add to them